Conformation Training

I don’t see the point in mentioning players who have been absent from the game or their horses. Is it because you want that horse? Releasing horses from members just because they haven’t logged on is stealing. It’s theirs whether they bought it or bred it. I have been playing Equiverse since 2012 and the longest period I went without playing was 2-3 years. You have no idea how grateful I am to continue coming back to the game with my things untouched. It doesn’t affect anyone for players and their horses to be locked, especially considering if they were active the horse would still be theirs. 

I do think conformation needs more function. I don’t breed for it at all and couldn’t care less about a horse’s conformation because it doesn’t really change anything. I think if it was given more function, say it could affect show results slightly, I would like that. In real life, a lot of breeding horses is to pair them so that their conformation works together to create a better horse, there’s not a ton you can do training wise to change the actual structure of a horse in which is was born with so so while I do think training for conformation would be nice, I don’t think it should be the biggest way to improve conformation. I do see where a horse with a poor top line or lack of hip can be greatly improved through gaining muscle and training, which is where I think training should come into play, but it’s not like you can shorten a horse’s back by training it, that comes purely from breeding. 

I don't have anything against having a way to train conformation. Even if it was maybe just a little bit for any given horse, so future generations could be a little better than the last. Say maybe you could increase 5-10% for one horse. I don't personally care a whole lot about conformation, but I know plenty of people do.

I do have an issue, however, with this concept of releasing peoples horses because they aren't active enough for someone else's liking. Or not allowing them to be locked for extended periods. I don't know what it is lately, but the concept of taking things from other players because you don't feel they need it, or deserve it, or that you feel you could use it better, is weird. I love EV because I can be gone for any amount of time I want, and still come back to what I left with. I've played other games that delete your stuff after a given period of time, and I never end up going back to them, because all the hard work I had is just gone. I have 1000ish horses on here. I don't have it in me to work with them all at once, but if you want to keep your horses unlocked and let them die if you don't care for them when you log in, that's on you. You're welcome to play how you'd like, and I'll keep locking up my 900 horses for months to save my own sanity xD

But to the main point of this topic, I still think maybe it should be a limited amount of improvement for each horse. Since like others have said, you can't "realistically" 100% fix a horses conformation. Which "realistic" is its own battle around here these days, but I digress. 

well, a horse with poor leg conformation will likely brush its front legs, hurting itself. Often Brushing Boots are used but I think there is a way to fix the stance a tiny bit to help reduce this issue, so a *slight* increase in confo I like, maybe just round up to the nearest solid number? 

This why I put this in EC, and not in Suggestions!


Last edited on 2023-01-13 at 23:24:54 by Wrangler

I by no means am a conformation breeder, because conformation doesn't affect anything on this game. I'm purely NSS first and Color second. However, I would breed for conformation if it affected *a little bit* of how horses were shown in shows. I don't agree with changing the decimals around from 80 to 8, because like stated before, a horse with 8% conformation would likely not survive realistically. I feel like Foundation Horses should start maybe around 40-50% instead of 50-60%. That way it gives you room to increase your horse's conformation 5-10% and then you can breed for a higher base conformation in the foals. With eventually getting your horses theoretically up to 100% perfect conformation. 

As for the releasing of horses that are in inactive player accounts or horses that are locked for long periods of time. I don't agree with this. This is the Art Issue all over again. No one needs to take horses, money, credits, items, etc.. from anyone. They don't belong to anyone but their owners and they don't affect any of the playability of the game. Money and Credits that are just sitting in an inactive account doesn't affect the economy. Horses that are locked or on inactive accounts doesn't affect anyone else. Sure that person may have the perfect stats/conformation/color you may be looking for, but it's their choice what they do with their property. It may suck that you can't breed with that horse to further your lines, but that's just incentive for you to work harder to get your own horses to where you want to be. 

A lot of people work hard for months and years to perfect the lines they have. If I had finally perfected my lines after playing continuously for 2 years and then I had to take a 6 month or year hiatus due to real life only to come back and all my horses and money from showing, selling, riding schools, etc.. was gone? I would be livid and never come back to the game. That was two years of my life that I won't get back, all because some think it's okay to take from others. 

Age was mentioned earlier, that Wrangler was more than likely older than most on here and that may be so, but most people that I've seen play this game is in their 20s and 30s and even 40s. Sure there may be quite a few younger players that are around 10-18 as well, but a lot of people that play are adults from at least 18+. (This doesn't have anything to do with the topic at hand. I just wanted to point it out that there is an older player base.)

I totally agree with what Deer Creek and the others said!!! I can track my horses lines back many years, quite a few I can track back to my very first horses when I first joined this game in 2008. I don't always have time to work with them, which is why I love the Locking feature so much. One thing's for sure,  if my horses just up and disappeared because someone decided I hadn't been on it a long time, and didn't deserve the horses, credits, money, and  items anymore; I would be so mad, demanding my horses back, and or quitting the game. I've had a horse stolen from me before; don't care to repeat that experience.

Yes I can understand the frustration some might be feeling about seeing awesome horses locked up for years on end, however, I have learned how to work with my horses to get the non-specially stats and conformation I need, lock the horse or horses I want to breed but don't have the horse that is needed for the breeding at the moment, then go from there.

Not to mention a lot of people get extremely attached to their pixel ponies; me included.

Last edited on 2023-01-14 at 07:56:58 by 💜ℱℯ𝒶𝓉𝒽ℯ𝓇 (ℱ𝒢) 💜

Everyone is entitled to have their opinions even if it's unpopular opinions. 

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I am curious. What does everyone think about potentially switching the conformation system from numeral-based to genetic-based?

What do you mean by genetic based? I'm not necessarily for it because I don't think I understand what you mean, but I'm not against it. I do think that the conformation system needs to be reworked in some kind of way.

@ Deer Creek,

Most games I've been to usually use numeral-based systems for conformation. However, I recently found a quite realistic game that used a genetic system instead. 

They assigned a set of alleles for each conformation trait. 

The basic gist of their system is:

Perfect would be HH HH HH HH | hh hh hh hh
Poor would be hh hh hh hh | HH HH HH HH

Ex:
Head - HH HH HH HH | hh hh hh hh (Perfect)
Neck - HH HH hh hh | HH HH hh hh (Average)
Legs - hh hh hh hh | HH HH HH HH (Poor)
Knees - Hh HH Hh HH | hh hh hh hh (Perfect because H is the dominant trait)

BREEDING EXAMPLE:
SIRE HEAD: HH Hh hh HH | hh hh HH Hh
DAM HEAD: HH hh Hh HH | hh Hh HH Hh

FOAL HEAD: BOLD is the ideal allele to get for the best outcome.
1: HH (100%)
2: Hh (25%) or hh (75%)
3: Hh (25%) or hh (75%)
4: HH (100%)
-
5: hh (100%)
6: Hh (25%) or hh (75%)
7: HH (100%)
8: HH (25%) or Hh (50%) or hh (25%)

Based on the odds,
The Foal's Head is most likely to be HH hh hh HH | hh hh HH Hh which means the most likely outcome from this pairing will be average.

-- --

Personally, I enjoyed it because it's easier to understand how conformation works as it's similar to the colors but it's still challenging as you will still need to be strategic with pairings. You also know exactly what will be your odds be. If you pair HH with HH, you know that you will get HH no matter what. HH with Hh, 75% HH, 25% Hh.

However, I think 8 sets of alleles per trait are a tad too much for me, personally. Obviously, we cannot copy that game's system due to copyright issues probably, but I wonder if we can develop our own genetic system that is suitable for EV.

Last edited on 2023-01-14 at 09:28:47 by 𝕷𝖚𝖈𝖎𝖆

@Lucia~ I don't quite understand it, but I get the idea and I love it :D

@Feather~ How did you have your horses stolen? now you have me interested and I simply MuSt know more xD

@Lucia

Hmm. I'm not sure how that would completely be implemented for conformation, but I can see the appeal in it. I agree that I think 8 alleles are too many. It made my head hurt. Lol. I do think that it could be tweaked to be maybe only 1-3. That way we can still keep the conformation layout in the same area. 

Yeah, I do see your point as I am not sure how to implement it in the game either. IMO, any kind of changes to conformation will be hard to be implemented due to a major conformation imbalance in existing horses. 

Personally, I think 4 should be the maximum. I think 1-2 is too easy. So I am leaning toward 3-4, personally, as I do enjoy some challenges lol.

EDIT:

Another idea is to reduce the number of alleles but introduce a tier system. 

Perfect would be H5H5 and poor would be h1h1 so we need to work toward H5H5.
If paired wrong, the tier can be dropped instead of upped. 
Obviously, I don't have logistics down on how the tier system works so if someone else wants to figure this out, feel free.

Last edited on 2023-01-14 at 10:13:16 by 𝕷𝖚𝖈𝖎𝖆

I get really dizzy if I see all this..

@ Wrangler, that's why I suggested that we developed our own system. Their system is a good idea but is too advanced for EV as EV is a simpler and less realistic game than the game I am talking about. We can develop a different genetic-based system that's more suitable for EV.

Last edited on 2023-01-15 at 11:09:31 by 𝕷𝖚𝖈𝖎𝖆